Current YF2 Status

Tazeps

Hi there,

I've been away for a long time and I'm curious as to what YL2 is capable of atm. Are animations/interactions implemented yet ? Can 2 characters have a set of interaction/penetration yet ? Or is it only capable of character creation  so far ?

odes

Hi there @Tazeps !

Sorry for not getting back to you sooner. I've been wanting to reply to this but I've been so busy with other things.

Animations are not implemented yet, but it's something we're going to start working on this year. Right now we're working on a clothing component, so you'll be able to import clothing made externally and apply it to character so the it will follow the body.

Once this component is finished, just a few more features remain before we can start working on interactions. We've already started working on them in a sense, since we're making changes to our models in preparation for interactions.

All the best.
- odes

Tazeps

nice! :O importing externally made clothing sounds cool!!
Thanks for the reply

are you guys still using trello ? I really liked looking at your work there

RedRapture

Bump on this, what is Yiffalicious' current status now that it's October 2022.

odes

@RedRapture Yiffalicious is not receiving any more updates.

If you meant FurryVNE - we're still in the process of implementing interactions. We have some major, fundamental system implemented and it's looking very promising.  You can see some of the progress on my Twitter.

Unfortunately, we hit a rather big bug in Unity that doesn't look like it will be fixed until Unity 2023, which is scheduled for release next year (usually around May). We might be able to upgrade to an alpha or beta release of Unity 2023 to get around this bug, but right now we're hoping Unity (the company) will backport the fix to Unity 2021 LTS or Unity 2022. Until then, we're working on other things (right now integrating soft bodies into interactions).

Once we ran out of things to do and have to work on the things this bug is preventing us from, we'll try to upgrade to alpha/beta release unless bug fix was already backported by then.

RedRapture

So, years later, we have Yiffalicious 1 not receiving anymore updates, new characters, or new locations, and a FurryVNE that we cannot make scenes on. Almost the exact same as when I stopped supporting on Patreon due to lack of progress. Gotchya.

Rugarou

@RedRapture my thoughts exactly, and now the forums are going away so i assume the cloud will be disconnected from yiff 1 also.

they have not been very focused on animation, I have been watching the project for a long time now and there is virtually no movement in animation scenes, they do however release model parts constantly and say they are being developed in parallel but after a couple years now, its hard to believe.

now, they are chopping the legs out from under yiff to force ppl to thier new platform which as you pointed out, is a great character creator, but thats literally all it is at this point and for the last several years.

but as they will soon pop on to point out, "its a labor of love" they will always fork out an excuse as to why they are dragging thier feet on this project.

Brownmane

@Rugarou

they have not been very focused on animation, I have been watching the project for a long time now and there is virtually no movement in animation scenes

Then you've not been reading the devlogs, I'm guessing. The model parts are Dogson's (the primary 3D modeller) part of the equation to keep the lights on while Odes (the one single coder the project has, keep that in mind) is hard at work fixing up the various systems and subsystems a complete animation suite requires, and he can't just import old code from YL because they had to abandon it precisely because that old code had accrued too much technical debt (i.e. it was done fast and slapdash to get things done quick, so it broke every time you tried to build new features on top of it). Issue right now is that a memory leak bug within Unity itself is preventing them from rapidly iterating on the planned method for penetration mechanics, which is arguably the single most important feature in a porn animation toolbox, and Unity's not being cooperative in fixing the issue. They've got a plan to use a different, less robust penetration system as a stopgap measure if Unity can't get their act together in a timely fashion (which seems unlikely, given they claimed they fixed the bug in the version they're building FVNE in but lo and behold, the memory leaks are still happening), but remains to be seen how that all shakes out; last update was a month ago, so maybe there'll be something new soon since they've kept to a monthly schedule fairly consistently.

Now, this could all be an elaborate ruse, complete with demonstrations of parts of the animation system in action, to keep the Patreon bucks flowing for as long as possible, but Odes doesn't strike me as the sort to pull an underhanded move like that. He'd certainly never be welcome in any game dev circle people consider trustworthy after a stunt like that, and a big portion of the furry crowd would also turn their backs on him for promising greatness and delivering fraud instead, so he'd be burning a lot of bridges for ultimately very little gain, as the revenue stream's constantly dropping as long as the animation suite remains in development hell.

As for the forums going the way of the dodo, it's unfortunate but understandable. It costs money to keep hosting it, and the financial woes are piling on right now. Once the animation suite is done, YL will be functionally obsolete as well, though I wouldn't be too surprised if the FVNE cloud will have a section for the legacy stuff as well after the axe falls here. If not, there's always third-party sites you can go to if you want to keep the flame alive. Maybe Odes could even be persuaded to part with the old YL source code, if not now then maybe once FVNE is on more stable footing.

Rugarou

Actually ive followed the project for over 3 years now. You have a slew of excuses as is predictable but its literally all conjecture. As for eleborate schemes and other flights of fancy, perhaps it is you whom have not been paying attention? Its a quite popular thing in the furry community to make promises, take money, then not deliver.
The project is being done in unity, it doesn't require a game engine to be coded, thats already been done. some plugins may need to be written, but its not what you are making it out to be. There are a ton of games in unity that dont suffer from issues so thats a bit weak mate.

FurryVNE is behind a paywall, this is also to be considered.

The . yiff files for yifflicious are tiny also so as for the hosting it can be done off the same server. Same with forums. Theres literally no reason to cut yiffilicious off except to force ppl to FurryVNE which is behind a paywall and incomplete and not a replacement for yiffalicious which has animation and rather simple animations to make. Its fanbase still gains new users also. They just arent making money off it so it needs to be swatted.

Brownmane

@Rugarou
Let me point out all you have is conjecture as well. Neither of us has any real insight into the development process other than educated guesses based on what's been told to us in scripted videos and written devlogs and what little personal experience we have of software development to help us read between the lines.

I'm painfully aware of how prone furry game projects are to failing for one reason or the other, believe you me (usually due to drama between big egos in the dev team, which thankfully doesn't seem to be the likely case with FVNE thanks to the team being a grand total of two people and a handful of occasional contractors). Maybe it's a bit of personal bias on my part since I really want this project to succeed, but I don't feel like I've seen anything highly suggestive of the bottom falling out on it just yet. Then again, sometimes the death knell comes suddenly, as it did with Breeding Season due to the lead artist running with a good chunk of the team's savings and making his own competing game with it. Thankfully, those are edge cases and usually you see impending doom coming much earlier. You might choose to interpret things differently, but I'd say if we're being scammed, they're putting in way more effort to maintain the illusion of development than it's worth, considering experienced coders are always in high demand in the tech industry and the positions pay quite well, so what's the point of an elaborate hoax complete with video demonstrations of new features and additional body parts for the character creator if all you get out of it is $6000 per month that you have to pay tax on and then split between the team?

Unity might be a ready-made game engine, but that doesn't mean you can just install a couple of things from the asset store, plonk them on the default scene and call it ready for release. Unless you're making the kind of shovelware you'd kinda get crucified for if you try to sell it in this day and age, of course. And if you encounter a bug within Unity itself rather than in a snippet of code you wrote yourself? You're shit out of luck kid, Unity ain't an open-source project where you can modify the engine itself on your own (Godot would be an engine where you actually can not only do that, but also then introduce the fix you made to future public releases of the engine, which is why Odes said his next project is using that engine instead), you gotta wait for Unity's bloated corporate structure of bureaucracy to first determine there actually is a problem to fix and then you gotta wait for them to tell their dev team (which is often the department least respected and supported in large companies despite doing most of the productive work) that there's a problem and to maybe get around to it if you've got nothing more important to tackle right now. And, like last time, the fix might not even work for any number of reasons once you do get it. The latest update that dropped 11 hours ago links to a new support ticket for a fix to the fix on Unity's own site, so they acknowledge that it didn't work, which confirms Odes isn't lying about that part of the problem, at least.

Even tiny files cost something to host. Now, if Odes does nuke the old YL cloud that probably could easily piggyback on the server of the new FVNE cloud, I'll call that an unequivocal dick move. The forums are a bit of a different matter, though; you can host them on a server easy enough, but you also gotta pay for the third-party domain name server if you want people to be able to find it without the direct IP address like true and proper IT nerds. I don't know exactly how much that costs, probably not all that much, but in hard times you gotta cut costs, and this kind of redundant forum platform is at the top of that list when you've got a cloud in the game itself that supports commenting. I do hope they improve that feature, though, make it a bit more like the forum before the axe falls; I haven't looked at it recently but last when I did, it was still pretty bare-bones.

As for paywalls, there's always ways around them if you know how to sail the seven seas. It's an unfortunate fact of commerce on the internet and trying to combat it does more harm than good, so a lot of the smaller porn game teams out there basically view it as an unauthorized free demo that requires a few extra steps to access and therefore don't even bother making their own, censored public demo builds as that takes away from their already limited development resources and likely won't matter much since people are always gonna want to see the uncensored goods anyway before they make the decision to spend money. Don't know what sort of release model they're planning to use for FVNE going forward, but considering YL's model of releasing old builds to the public with the newer stuff behind the Patreon wall, I wouldn't be surprised if they do something like release the character creator builds to the public while the animation suite is behind the paywall, which they'll follow the YL model with once they've got a few releases of it under their belts. We shall see.

odes

I wasn't going to reply to any of the accusations because I honestly think they're asinine and not worth my time, but I had some time over and seeing how there's actually some that still believe in this project, it revitalized something in me to actually make a statement. So here we go.

@Rugarou

I have been watching the project for a long time now and there is virtually no movement in animation scenes, they do however release model parts constantly and say they are being developed in parallel but after a couple years now, its hard to believe.

The interaction systems haven't been in development for "a couple of years". They've been in development since Autumn 2021. So that's roughly 1 year and 1 quarter.

@Rugarou

now, they are chopping the legs out from under yiff to force ppl to thier new platform

How are we chopping the legs off? Yiffalicious is and will continue to be available for as long as we're in business, cloud and all.

but as they will soon pop on to point out, "its a labor of love" they will always fork out an excuse as to why they are dragging thier feet on this project.

What excuses? We're working on the project and we're sharing the progress, as we have always done.

@Rugarou

Actually ive followed the project for over 3 years now. You have a slew of excuses as is predictable but its literally all conjecture. As for eleborate schemes and other flights of fancy, perhaps it is you whom have not been paying attention? Its a quite popular thing in the furry community to make promises, take money, then not deliver.

The project is being done in unity, it doesn't require a game engine to be coded, thats already been done. some plugins may need to be written, but its not what you are making it out to be. There are a ton of games in unity that dont suffer from issues so thats a bit weak mate.

You're literally making things up to fit some kind of demented narrative, combined with a shocking display of ignorance in regards to how software development is actually made.

Mention any furry adult project (or any adult project for that matter) that have realtime orifice simulation (not pre-animated, but actual physical simulation), soft body physics, dynamic inflation, physically simulated shafts (and not just the shaft itself, but also its emergence from body, erection/stiffness and growth), physical IK, NONE OF WHICH IS PRE-ANIMATED.

There is none, because these things don't exist. You have to make it all yourself.

Given that we have been only working on it for a bit more than one year (and for salaries like that of janitors), that is a unreal amount of work to have accomplished for a team our size.

If all we were doing was throwing some asset-flip together, or just pre-animating some content, you can most assuredly have gotten something out quicker. But that's not what we're doing. We're investing heavily into research and development, trying to offer something that is technologically superior. That is not easy to do.

@Rugarou

FurryVNE is behind a paywall, this is also to be considered.

As opposed to other teams ... ? Look at any other Furry project. They're for the most part not only making more, but significantly so, while also (in some cases) doing far less.

We're hardly making ends meet already as it is. Removing incentive to support us financially might kill off this project entirely.

@Rugarou

The . yiff files for yifflicious are tiny also so as for the hosting it can be done off the same server. Same with forums. Theres literally no reason to cut yiffilicious off except to force ppl to FurryVNE which is behind a paywall and incomplete and not a replacement for yiffalicious which has animation and rather simple animations to make. Its fanbase still gains new users also. They just arent making money off it so it needs to be swatted.

I'm not sure where this idea comes from as we have never ever said in any space or in any form that Yiffalicious is being shut down. Again, more of some narrative to paint us in a bad light? Why?

Rugarou

I stated what I stated becuse its the pattern of development. I cant help it if you dont like critique but it certainly serves no purpose to live and exist in an echo chamber. I did not assassinate character or say you were bad people and you need to understand that.

so to reply to your itemized list and address a few things you said as well.

a couple is two, and as for the year and a quarter, you may have put those systems into development at that time, but they had been spoken of for much longer than that, its been misleading. which is why yall added the disclaimer line about the systems being worked on in parallel, also furryVNE or YL2 has been in dev since 2017.

as for chopping the legs out from under YL1, how are NOT by closing the forums? theres no other reason to do it.

as for me making things up to fit a narrative, that is amusing. soft body physics? "come closer", theres a game with soft body right off the top of my head, everything youve listed has been done in some form already, VAM does alot of these things also, so maybe research and collabarate a bit with others in your field, it certainly helps when learning to do something you havent done before.

additionally you dont have to look purely to gaming or sex sim software to find the things you are wanting. crash dummy physics as an example.

salary of janitors? theres two of you, janitors in your respective countries get paid pretty well my friend.

paywall, if you havent logged out of your own patreon in awhile and tried to look at it, theres not much of anything to see, you cant even read a devlog without paying.

if you dont want to show vids or pics of whats going on, fine but at least let us read what yall are doing? how do you expect ppl to support a project they know nothing about?

Ive said it before about 2 years ago id be back when interactions were in. they were supposed to be soon then.

there are plenty of us whom remember this and we do discuss it. few bring it forward becuse of all this.

so no we arent discussing conjecture, its a pattern.

and its not that im painting you in any light. its a thing thats happening and its being addressed, and Im not the only one that thinks this is going to be vaporware until i actually see the interaction system in place and accessible, until then its still just perpetually "soon"

lol edited here so i could actually reply, you attempt to drag me and yet everything ive said is readily availible for viewing.. guess thats why you had to write an epitaph and then shut down venue of convo. very mature of the odes.... continue living in an echo chamber.

and yes VAM has soft body physics.

https://gyazo.com/4f947c0be232a9a0330e315a0baed879

heres a screen shot =p

yall arent doing anything revolutionary or new.

maybe the Odes is the oblivious one?

and I also dont care what the Odes thinks or says, cuz as Ive said before, until you actually DO the thing, its vaporware.

odes

I stated what I stated becuse its the pattern of development. I cant help it if you dont like critique but it certainly serves no purpose to live and exist in an echo chamber. I did not assassinate character or say you were bad people and you need to understand that.

I'm writing this reply here for any 3rd party reader as addressing Rugarou is going nowhere.

So to re-iterate, Rugarou made claims that are provably false. Yiffalicious is not and has never been intended to be shut down. There is no way anyone would conflate forum software from the actual app itself. To backtrack and then divert their claims from the software being shut down to the forum is not believable, as there is no way anyone would mix these two separate things up. To me it feels more like a desperate attempt to make their accusations seem valid.

Also, for the record, I do not mind critique. It's questionable whether what Rugarou is doing could be called critique though. If they want to be taken seriously, they shouldn't have to make things up to fit a negative narrative of us.

a couple is two, and as for the year and a quarter, you may have put those systems into development at that time, but they had been spoken of for much longer than that, its been misleading. which is why yall added the disclaimer line about the systems being worked on in parallel, also furryVNE or YL2 has been in dev since 2017.

For anyone reading - we have not, in those years, even hinted at interactions being close to being done. On the contrary, we have consistently and repeatedly made it very clear that the character builder was our focus, and that only after it was completed would we start working on interactions.

Notice, again, how Rugarou is immediately jumping to conclusions in order paint us in a bad light. In this case, it's the disclaimer that is the vessel of his narrative.

To claim that the intention behind the disclaimer is to misled our users is absurd, as the whole point of it is the complete opposite - it was put there in order to inform.

We noticed a lot of people were confused by the content builds that we were doing while we were working on interactions, and we received a lot of messages and questions asking about interactions. As you might imagine, having to reply to the same questions again and again is neither fun nor great use our time (time we could spend on actually work on the project instead). So we started putting that message there, and sure enough the that reduced the amount of messages we had to deal with.

To claim we're doing it to mislead is preposterous, and if you think about it there's no way anyone would come up such a poor way to interpret the situation unless their intent is hell bent on trying to make us look bad.

as for chopping the legs out from under YL1, how are NOT by closing the forums? theres no other reason to do it.

The forums have nothing to do with the Yiffalicious (the software). They are two separate entities.

As for the reason, we have addressed it here:

https://discord.com/channels/242443199254102016/794959659370545172/1054935917829296191

In short - we can't even log into the server anymore. It's a miracle it hasn't gone down already.

When we wrote that post, people were already getting database errors when trying to post since the server is running out of space.

The only reason this forum is still up is because we still have access phpmyadmin, where we could delete a lot of spam accounts, which freed up memory. I didn't think the forum would stay up this long from that action alone, but the fact remains that it's a matter of time before it'll completely stop working.

as for me making things up to fit a narrative, that is amusing. soft body physics? "come closer", theres a game with soft body right off the top of my head, everything youve listed has been done in some form already, VAM does alot of these things also, so maybe research and collabarate a bit with others in your field, it certainly helps when learning to do something you havent done before.

VAM does not have soft body physics afaik. I'm happy to be proven wrong though. I'm always up for taking inspiration from others. So if anyone can share clips I'd be happy to study them.

Considering our team size and funding, again, I'm proud of what we have managed to accomplish. If you look at this objectively, it's ludicrous (and honestly quite disrespectful) to expect a single programmer to accomplish all these custom systems in less than a year, all while being severely underpaid.

I'm very proud of our achievements and there's no way in hell anyone gets to turn that around and say we didn't do it quick enough. Few people would be able to implement their own IK system, physics engine, collision system, soft body engine and hand placement system in a year (in addition to animation tools and editor).

additionally you dont have to look purely to gaming or sex sim software to find the things you are wanting. crash dummy physics as an example.

The ragdoll physics Unity offers is based off PhysX, which as considerable problems and cannot be used for what we want it to do.

We have covered our reasoning for implementing our own systems in detail here:

https://www.patreon.com/posts/ragdoll-physics-56581652
https://www.patreon.com/posts/animation-57851368

salary of janitors? theres two of you, janitors in your respective countries get paid pretty well my friend.

I'm not quite sure of Rugarou's reasoning here. If there's more people sharing a set amount of money, then there's less over for each one. So to emphasize that there's two of us as some sort of point that we're making good money makes no sense to me.

Sweden has among the highest taxes in the world. Right now we're making around $6000-$7000 per month, and we're paying 29k SEK per month in taxes ($2773,75). In theory we should pay less but there's always more in practice once all the different employment taxes have been summed up.

In the end, there's not a lot of money left over for dogson and me if we split it. Furthermore, we also have expenses in the company.

paywall, if you havent logged out of your own patreon in awhile and tried to look at it, theres not much of anything to see, you cant even read a devlog without paying.
if you dont want to show vids or pics of whats going on, fine but at least let us read what yall are doing? how do you expect ppl to support a project they know nothing about?

Patreon does not allow us to share adult rated stuff publicly. We have been reprimanded for doing it and threatened to have our page closed. That's why we started posting summaries on Twitter, which we have linked to on many occasions from Patreon:

https://twitter.com/furryodes/media

Ive said it before about 2 years ago id be back when interactions were in. they were supposed to be soon then. there are plenty of us whom remember this and we do discuss it. few bring it forward becuse of all this.

Notice they're making claims without any proof. Considering all the other things they're getting wrong, I doubt there's any truth to this.

We are and have always been careful with what we're saying, in the event we would be scrutinized for it. I highly doubt we said 2 years ago that interactions would be out "soon".

If I'm wrong about this, I'll happily apologize, but as I said I highly doubt there's any truth to it. Probably more lies to fit this negative narrative.

Furthermore, it's not memories what dictates what's true, it's actual evidence. A lot of people remember things that aren't true. It's called the Mandela effect.

Again, I'll happily be proven wrong if any evidence can be provided.

so no we arent discussing conjecture, its a pattern.
and its not that im painting you in any light.

The only pattern here is that Rugarou is consistently and repeatedly reinterpreting any situation in order to tell a narrative where we are the bad guys, without providing any evidence and while at the same time being refuted at every step of the way.

its a thing thats happening and its being addressed, and Im not the only one that thinks this is going to be vaporware until i actually see the interaction system in place and accessible, until then its still just perpetually "soon"

Again, we haven't even hinted at interactions being out "soon". I suppose the last Patreon post (Feb 2023) could be interpreted as a hint to interactions being close, but even then we're not saying "soon". All we've said is that next dev log will demonstrate interactions. There will be plenty of work before we can release it fully, which is exactly why we're NOT saying "soon".

At this point, I must admit I don't really care what Rugarou thinks as it is pretty clear at this point they are either trolling or are utterly oblivious to how their thinking is coming off.

odes

We neither have the time nor the inclination to argue with people who use falsehoods to accuse us of things we haven't done.

Any creative, thinking time that we don't spend on the project is time wasted, and I hate getting my time wasted. So because of Rugarou, we have decided to prematurely close the forum.

If anyone wants to continue this discussion, then do it at the inofficial Discord instead. Still eager to see any of that evidence.

All the best.
- odes